|
|
Post by javagirl on Mar 20, 2010 23:21:18 GMT -5
I am debating whether to attend UVic next year and join their running program.
I am hearing mixed reviews about the program and the head coach in particular. Some of his former athletes say he is difficult to communicate with , is uninspiring and does the bare minimum for his athletes. I also know that the climate and athletic atmostsphere on campus and in the city are excellent which led me to explore going there.
Anyone have any thoughts or experences with head coach Brent Fougner they can share?
I have to say the stories I have heard leave me wondering if this is the right place for me. I want to excell and want a coach who puts it heart into the job. Being a national event coach doesn't impress me much as it seems to be who you know not what you know that gets you in those postitons.
Thanks for any advice offered!
|
|
|
|
Post by wetcoast on Mar 21, 2010 0:10:55 GMT -5
Java,
In my interview with Justine Johnson who ended up at the University of Washington, she said that Keith Butler was a great coach and some other positive things too. He is a High School coach at Oak Bay High, just down the road from UVic. I understand Butler has been involved with UVic much more recently. I don't know the facts, maybe you want to research whether he would be involved too and perhaps he would be more to your style...just a thought.
|
|
|
|
Post by javagirl on Mar 21, 2010 10:16:40 GMT -5
Thanks. Yes I do want to do cross country.
I did talk to Keith Butler and he seems like a dedicated coach. From what I have heard Coach Fougner has foisted a lotof the work off on to Butler.....I do think the head coach sets the tone and with so many athletes feeling like he just doesn't care (more concerned about getting down to Arizona to golf)..I am torn on what to do. I guess I have been lucky with coaches in the past .
It seems also that many UVic athletes are considering leaving the program....not sure whether I should jump onto a sinking ship.
But again I love the west coast island lifestyle in many ways.
Much to think about. Thanks for your replies.
|
|
rl
New Member
Posts: 15
|
Post by rl on Mar 21, 2010 10:33:10 GMT -5
I think Brent and the Vikes program are getting ragged on a bit too much in this thread and a lot of it is undeserved. Also, I don't think too many people are going to come on here and talk about this in a public forum. Feel free to email me at richard.a.lehman@gmail.com if you have any questions about Brent and the Vikes.
|
|
|
|
Post by wetcoast on Mar 21, 2010 11:31:31 GMT -5
Mr. Lehman,
This is probably not the nicest way for a coach to find out what others are thinking, 'out there'. On the other hand she is citing information she has heard from others and is looking to verify or refute it, so it is a difficult thing. In reference to your comment on getting 'ragged on', I don't think she has slagged him directly, but is asking for feedback on what she has heard. In my particular case, I only pointed out that there is another coach who she may like - no slagging.
|
|
|
|
Post by random on Mar 21, 2010 11:51:01 GMT -5
Brent is a solid coach, and has a very good assistant with Keith Butler. Brent cares more about his athletes long term success than anything else, the focus of their program is on outdoors yet the team remains competitive in XC and indoors. In my time on the team Brent spent many weeks away from home taking us to training camps, despite leaving a young family at home, saying that he doesn't care about his athletes or the program is a very misguided. I've seen that guy drive a 1:58 runner to physio despite having 6 guys on the team 1:54 or faster, he then found that guy a better job so he could afford to train more.
It still baffles me that top runners looking to stay in Canada go anywhere else. I've worked with a number of runners that are current or former Vikes and all are/were happy with their experiences at UVic.
Javagirl, having read your second post, I feel that UVic doesn't need you in their program and that you'll be a team wrecker where ever you end up. Seriously, who comes onto a public forum and bashes a coach they don't even know?
|
|
F.T
Full Member
Posts: 293
|
Post by F.T on Mar 21, 2010 12:16:42 GMT -5
They don't put much focus on cross country, and outdoor is more the focus than indoor. This may or may not affect your decision, but something to consider if you really enjoy cross country. Havn't they won the 4x800 at CIS for a number of years now? seems like quite an accomplishment for a team not training for indoors.. And I dont understand why you would be upset at a coach who is aiming more for outdoor track than indoor. I understand that there is no outdoor CIS but there's plenty of better incentives for athletes to be aiming for the outdoor season... And as for their cross country season, they're women placed 4th and the men 11th and CIS XC, so clearly there had to be some focus on cross country as well. |
|
leroy
Junior Member
Posts: 91
|
Post by leroy on Mar 21, 2010 12:30:19 GMT -5
I cannot comment on the program or coaches at uvic, but Javagirl it certainly seems like you are taking shots at Brent and the program on a public forum where you can remain anonymous. What other usernames have you used in the past, considering that Javagirl only has 2 posts?
Better option would be to PM any victoria people on the boards here.
|
|
davidson
Full Member
"only the struggle makes it worth it, only the pain makes it sweet and only victory is the answer"
Posts: 131
|
Post by davidson on Mar 21, 2010 17:04:32 GMT -5
Brent definitely knows his stuff and cares a lot for his athletes and their long-term development. Unlike other programs, the Vikes rarely have a chance at team titles so no one is ever forced to run too many events for the sake of the team (something that you don't get with other teams).
The 4x8 has been 5 years in a row now and beyond that the team did well for a few years (at least as far back as I know). And other than Dan Mallie, Brent's been the only other constant for those five years.
As for Cross Country, there was always a focus on doing well. It all comes down to who are on the teams. The Vikes are consistently among the top teams at CIS for both men and women and if you look back a few years you'll see a few team wins (though I'm not sure if that was Brent or another frequent poster on this board).
I enjoyed my years at UVic and ran several PB's while training in an incredible city with a team that had a great atmosphere (at least at the time, most of the people I know have graduated or are close to it).
If you have more specific questions feel free to PM me, but Rich will give you better responses.
Also keep in mind, almost every team has a disgruntled ex- or current athlete. I'm not sure who you've been talking to, but perhaps you're getting a biased version of events.
Good luck with your choice. Victoria is probably the nicest place I've ever lived in.
|
|
|
|
Post by javagirl on Mar 21, 2010 17:38:47 GMT -5
Nice to hear so many positive things as well.
Thanks everyone.
|
|
|
|
Post by maser on Mar 21, 2010 20:58:01 GMT -5
Javagirl; Both Brent and Keith have extensive backgrounds in track as athletes and coaching. Track has always been a sport were there is a lot of here say and politics. The U of Vic program has always had some great coaches and athletes. it might we worth looking at. I think they have a great program. The only other places I would recommend would be Guelph ( Dave Scott Thomas) or Calgary ( Mike Van Tighem). You also have to consider the academics -- all 3 Universities have great programs. Before you make any judgements its always good to meet the coaches personally and take it from there. There a lot of good people in the sport - they are all there to help you.
cheers
Kim
|
|
|
|
Post by aklives on Mar 21, 2010 21:53:37 GMT -5
But again I love the west coast island lifestyle in many ways. If you really enjoy the West Coast lifestyle, you can always take a look at UBC... Not quite the island but something to consider. |
|
|
|
Post by oldster on Mar 21, 2010 22:13:01 GMT -5
Guys, it's great that you're defending Brent and UVIC (not that they NEED defending); but, "javagirl" is an obvious troll, and quite likely not a "girl" at all. I mean, who puts that much gratuitous innuendo into a post ostensibly asking for "info" on a program? (More interested in "golfing in Arizona" than coaching!? Who but someone nursing a huge grudge against Brent would bother saying this kind of thing publicly? Who indeed...). This person should have been ignored after "her" second post.
|
|
|
|
Post by maser on Mar 21, 2010 22:46:47 GMT -5
You might be right. But it is good to be up front about some of the coaches/programs that are out there. There are a lot of good people in the sport. Lots of good kids out there looking for advice and then there are the trolls. You should know that.  Cheers KM |
|
|
|
Post by roseyrunner on Mar 21, 2010 23:24:44 GMT -5
I have to add my comments. I think that Brent is a fabulous coach. Any suggestion that he does not emphasize cross-country is utterly wrong. Having competed for three years in the program, I can definitely attest to the fact that he is an excellent cross-country coach.
Brent has trained me for everything from 1500 to 10kms. I have seen incredible improvements in my times, especially in the 5km and the 10 km. He has always been very supportive.
I'm not the only one who has experienced major improvements.
Deirdre Moran - went from an 11 minute 3km to breaking 10:08 in one year, then broke 10 this year. 16th in CIS this year, last year she was in the 40s or something.
Julia Tschanz - went from a 3km time in the 10:20s last year to a 9:39 this year
Shout outs also to Claire Jean, who is running faster than ever.
The women's x-country team will be stacked next year, and I'm really sad I will not be able to participate. Anyone who would suggest that we only focus on track, especially with respect to the women, is misled.
If you'd like to talk more, please send me a personal message.
|
|
|
|
Post by kbutler on Mar 22, 2010 22:24:04 GMT -5
From my perspective our women's team is thriving. Julia Tshanz won bronze in both the 1500m and 3000m at the recent CIS indoors while Claire Jean was fourth in the 1500m. Both lowered their personal best times in the 1500m to 4:29. Both also improved their 3000m personal bests by significant margins. Ashley Hinther (2008 CIS 1500m champion) and Laura Maludzinski (4:20 personal best) are also members of our training group. Both set personal bests at the UW indoor last chance meet on March 1st. All of our female team members set personal bests in one or more of their events this past indoor season. To say that UVic does not focus on indoors is not accurate. We prepare well for these championships and perform well. The fact is that we don't race a lot but focus on training. We want our athletes to have a solid base of training for the summer season with the goal of helping them reach national teams. Ashley and Laura both set pb's March 1st despite this being their first and only race of the indoor season. To say that UVic does not focus on cross country is not accurate. All of our scoring runners from the women's 4th place CIS XC championship team return next year and we have added two very good female recruits to the team so far this recruiting season. UVic has a storied history, first under Ron Bowker and now under Brent Fougner. Brent's team have won several CIS XC championship titles. I am the coach in charge of recruiting but once we get to the point where a recruit is serious about UVic then Brent does get involved and talks to the recruit. I am a first hand witness to the number of phone calls, emails and meetings Brent holds with our team members. Our training calendar and competition schedule for the year was published on day one of our season back in September. As the associate coach I can attest that Brent is an excellent person to work with. I am clear as to what my role is with the team and am able to speak my mind freely. I believe our athletes feel the same way. Our team traveled to cross country races in Portland and San Diego last fall and once exams are over a selected group of athletes will travel from the Oregon Relays in Eugene for a two week training camp in Arizona. We have a very supportive university and the best city in Canada in which to live and train. Please send me an email at keithb@uvic.ca if you would like more information about our women's or men's program. Also go to the recently launched www.runvictoria.com to learn more about the national center in Victoria. Keith Butler Associate coach University of Victoria |
|
|
|
Post by petercorrigan on Mar 23, 2010 2:06:05 GMT -5
I agree with Rich, this is a bit rough. There is no harm in coming on here and asking the opinions of other people, but to come on a right off the bat just totally call out the entire training centre is a little unnecessary. You could have voiced the same questions and probably headed many of the same answers using a much better approach.
Again, as with Rich I'm not going to type out a long explanation about the training group, centre, or the coaches on TnF North. But please send me an e-mail at peter.corrigan89@gmail.com and I'd love to answer any questions you may have or just give you some insight into the scene out here in Victoria.
|
|
|
|
Post by charliemurphy on Mar 23, 2010 13:13:13 GMT -5
The UVIC program, under Brent is nothing but first class. One of the few programs out there that offers a lot of great opportunities to runners of varing levels, only allowing them the opportunity to develop and get better. Any young runner should consider UVIC as a possible destentation for their post high school running, as the program adheres to individual goals, as well as the previous system you have been under. I have never met a person more eager to talk with an athletes's previous coach to gain a better understanding of what they're capable of.
|
|
|
|
Post by ronb on Mar 23, 2010 20:05:41 GMT -5
I never cease to be amazed by the BS that shows up on chatlines, even this one, which is better than most, in terms of mutual respect...
Anyone that comes on, and starts mouthing off about an individual, or a program, should at least have the testicles/ovaries to sign in under their real name. If not, then stfu...
The Uvic Vikes program in general, and Brent Fougner and Keith Butler in particular, are in the record books. If you really want to know, do some serious homework, and don't engage in chatline mud-slinging. The Vikes have been, and are, one of the best post-secondary programs for distance runners in North America. For a mid-sized school, in a mid-sized Canadian city, and without having had access to major funding for recruiting purposes, the Vikes results over the decades, both within CIS, and also in National results, are outstanding - that's a fact, deal with it. I always used to say, if you can't "do it" at Uvic and in Victoria, then you can't do it anywhere...just my opinion, of course.
|
|
|
|
Post by journeyman on Mar 24, 2010 7:26:34 GMT -5
Ron, I'd never think you would send someone to SFU over a CIS school... oh wait I misread that.  |
|
|
|
Post by ronb on Mar 24, 2010 8:31:54 GMT -5
Ron, I'd never think you would send someone to SFU over a CIS school... oh wait I misread that. Good one, John  The only CIS school I wouldn't recommend is Queen's. Not because I don't like the school or the staff or the program, it's just that the city of Kingston is considering barring the Big Mac, as a terrorist plot towards nutritional self-destruction. And the new slogan they are considering which is "TOFU Uber Alles !" is a little over the top, just my opinion...  |
|
|
|
Post by benjamin on Mar 24, 2010 11:32:27 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by maser on Mar 24, 2010 16:57:46 GMT -5
I never cease to be amazed by the BS that shows up on chatlines, even this one, which is better than most, in terms of mutual respect... Anyone that comes on, and starts mouthing off about an individual, or a program, should at least have the testicles/ovaries to sign in under their real name. If not, then stfu... The Uvic Vikes program in general, and Brent Fougner and Keith Butler in particular, are in the record books. If you really want to know, do some serious homework, and don't engage in chatline mud-slinging. The Vikes have been, and are, one of the best post-secondary programs for distance runners in North America. For a mid-sized school, in a mid-sized Canadian city, and without having had access to major funding for recruiting purposes, the Vikes results over the decades, both within CIS, and also in National results, are outstanding - that's a fact, deal with it. I always used to say, if you can't "do it" at Uvic and in Victoria, then you can't do it anywhere...just my opinion, of course. RonB- I see your still the same after all these years. U of Vic has always had a good program. They have always had some pretty fine talent coming out of there. I remember racing a few of your guys back in the day. Cheers KM |
|
|
|
Post by ronb on Mar 24, 2010 23:03:53 GMT -5
Hey Kim,
You and the U.of A. guys were tough-ass racers...
Were you on the team that won CIS in about 1980 or 1981?
I know Brian Rhodes was the lead Bear runner, and Jim Haddow
was the Coach, and I have a couple of great stories about the Tech.
Meeting, and Coaches BS session the night before the race...
Great to hear from you,
R.
|
|
|
|
Post by maser on Mar 25, 2010 7:16:56 GMT -5
Hey Ron; Good to hear from you. I was on that team in 1980 when we won in Guelph. Paul Williams was 1st , Peter Butler was 2nd. Paul McCloy was 5th, Brian Rhodes was 6th and I was 8th .
Haddow was the coach. Lots of fun back then. The girls from U of Vic won the womens race. Great bunch of ladies on that team.
Remember Randy Cox he was a pretty good runner. I ran against him in 81 CWUAA 5k indoors. Talented guy. You had some really good athletes at U of Vic.
Cheers
Kim
|
|
|
|
Post by ronb on Mar 25, 2010 13:19:43 GMT -5
Yes, and Rod Palm was 3rd, Ray Paulins was 4th, and Peter McKenney was 7th - you finished 8th behind some damned fine runners, KM. What other years did you race cross-country for Alberta?
The All-Canadians in CIS Cross-Country are on line, by the way.
Just google up "Canadian Interuniversity Sport", click on the new website, choose your language, then CIS Championships, then Cross Country, then Past Championship Results, either men or women. It's good stuff, and a great reminder of how many wonderful runners raced in CIS over the years.
|
|
|
|
Post by SI on Mar 25, 2010 13:46:50 GMT -5
Peter McKenney moved to Brantford a couple of years after that and I did some running with him and we still keep in touch a bit. You can't get beat by a much stronger field than that and I was in awe of the guy. Here he is with a real legend. Attachments:
|
|
|
|
Post by maser on Mar 25, 2010 19:28:03 GMT -5
Hi Guys. Ron That was great time to be around the sport lots of great athletes. Good memories. The U of T always had good teams. Tough guys to beat. U of Vic guys were tough as well. Cox was a pretty good athlete. I ran against him. Rod Palm in CWUAA 5k indoors in 81. I was 3rd. Pretty close race. I was happy with the races I ran. I had some pretty decent times. It's nice to see this new crop of distance runners some good kids out there. Hope they have as much fun as I had. SI (Martin) Peter McKenney was fine runner. The 1980 CIAU field was loaded. Some really good runners. HHH has some good stuff on his website. We beat the U of T record in 1983 at he old Jasper to Banff Relay. I passed off to John Bolger he ran 2 legs of the race 1:45 20 miler. I ran sub 5's the whole way. There is also a picture from the 1985 Canadian 10km road race Champs from Calgary. For nostalgia there is picture from Running Brave with me Robby Benson, Peter Moore and Darrell Menard. I played Gerry Lindgren, Darrell was Ron Clarke and peter was Biltenokoff from Russia. Billy Mills sent me the pic from the movie. Hope you guys like the nostalgia. Matt's site runningsolutions.shawwebspace.ca/profile/Cheers Kim |
|
|
|
Post by ronb on Mar 25, 2010 19:50:48 GMT -5
And another Albertan, Chris Judge, who came out and did some running with us in Victoria, was also in the movie.
|
|
Rory
New Member
Posts: 30 
|
Post by Rory on Mar 26, 2010 14:44:44 GMT -5
Also John Carroll as Ron Hill of Great Britain
|
|
The only CIS school I wouldn't recommend is Queen's. Not because I don't like the school or the staff or the program, it's just that the city of Kingston is considering barring the Big Mac, as a terrorist plot towards nutritional self-destruction. And the new slogan they are considering which is "TOFU Uber Alles !" is a little over the top, just my opinion... 
